Improving Mailer Yield is Fiction (LA 1629)
Improving Mailer Yield is Fiction (LA 1629)
Transcript:
Steven Jack Butala:
Steve and Jill here.
Jill K DeWit:
Hi.
Steven Jack Butala:
Welcome to the Land Academy Show, entertaining land investment talk. I’m Steven Jack Butala.
Jill K DeWit:
And I’m Jill DeWit, broadcasting from the Valley of the Sun.
Steven Jack Butala:
Today, Jill and I talk about improving your mailer yield and how it’s fiction.
Jill K DeWit:
Sounds very technical.
Steven Jack Butala:
It’s not.
Jill K DeWit:
Okay. It sounds technical.
Steven Jack Butala:
Actually, this is more of a chill topic than anything else. And at the end of this, there’s just a massive compliment for you. And I’m not trying to get anything from you, but it’s true.
Jill K DeWit:
Are you sure?
Steven Jack Butala:
We’ll see what happens. There might be-
Jill K DeWit:
If you were trying to get some … Let’s just talk for just a moment here. Let’s pause. Time out. If you were trying to get something from me, what would it be?
Steven Jack Butala:
Smiles.
Jill K DeWit:
Oh. That’s not what-
Steven Jack Butala:
I work for smiles.
Jill K DeWit:
What the heck? That’s hilarious.
Steven Jack Butala:
Do you ever see people like walking around Manhattan with the sign that says-
Jill K DeWit:
You’re kidding me.
Steven Jack Butala:
… “Hug me,” or, “I work for smile”?
Jill K DeWit:
I’ve never seen that.
Steven Jack Butala:
That’s the fastest way to get murdered.
Jill K DeWit:
Are you serious? People do that?
Steven Jack Butala:
Oh, yeah.
Jill K DeWit:
Not anymore, probably.
Steven Jack Butala:
Yeah, probably not. They’re probably in a hazmat suit.
Jill K DeWit:
Wow. Not for hugs. Oh my goodness. I’m trying to think, what would I be working for? You know what? Hey, truth time. Okay. I smile all the time. This is a fact.
Steven Jack Butala:
Yes, you do.
Jill K DeWit:
That’s easy. So, you’re not being totally upfront here, but-
Steven Jack Butala:
Didn’t take long to get off topic, but here we go. This is the conversation Jill and I had in the car on the way back in the RV, looking at some real estate recently. What’s your love language? what are the five love languages? Do you have this memorized?
Jill K DeWit:
Touch, acts of service.
Steven Jack Butala:
Acts of service.
Jill K DeWit:
You think I’m kidding? Words of affirmation. You guys know what I’m talking about. Affirmation. And then God, I can’t remember the other ones.
Steven Jack Butala:
There’s five.
Jill K DeWit:
Right.
Steven Jack Butala:
Touching, compliments.
Jill K DeWit:
But that’s affirmation.
Steven Jack Butala:
Doing stuff.
Jill K DeWit:
Acts of service. That’s acts of service.
Steven Jack Butala:
Which is doing stuff.
Jill K DeWit:
Yeah. I can’t remember-
Steven Jack Butala:
There’s other ones, two other ones. It doesn’t matter.
Jill K DeWit:
Yeah, I don’t remember.
Steven Jack Butala:
We both very quickly realized it’s all acts of service for us.
Jill K DeWit:
Yeah, but they’re different acts of service. I can’t believe we’re doing this. This is really truths time. My acts of service is like thank you for clearing the table. I didn’t have to say anything, and I just turned to around and you took care of the table and the dishes. I’m like, that’s awesome. Or even just lining up dinner and I don’t have to think about it. Thanks. Your version of acts of service, or doing something as you call it, is showing up to this podcast on time.
Steven Jack Butala:
Or starting a company without me knowing, and then it turn around and makes all kinds of money. That’s a great act. You’re the girl for me.
Jill K DeWit:
Thanks.
Steven Jack Butala:
Or buying a piece of real estate that generates a ridiculous return and a whole thing, I didn’t even know about it.
Jill K DeWit:
Right. It’s funny.
Steven Jack Butala:
So, yeah. But it’s not touch or anything like that. I mean, all those things happen, but for both of us.
Jill K DeWit:
Affection, like I like it, but it’s not as important to me as I come home and the house looks great. That’s what I love.
Steven Jack Butala:
Welcome to the Steve and Jill show, wrecking marriages everywhere.
Jill K DeWit:
That’s what-
Steven Jack Butala:
Every woman listening to this is going to go home and say, “What’s your love language? And whatever it is, I don’t like it.”
Jill K DeWit:
Yeah. Here’s the whole point of that. If you don’t know, if you haven’t read the book, I’m sure everybody here knows what we’re talking about if you read the book. You’ve got to do what the other person wants, not what you want. That’s the whole thing. You learn what they like.
Steven Jack Butala:
There’s a book?
Jill K DeWit:
Oh my gosh, yes. You didn’t … Yes, there’s several books.
Steven Jack Butala:
Of course there’s a book.
Jill K DeWit:
It’s like managing a company and managing employees. If you expect your employees to mirror you and act how you, you’re going to fail. But if you learn to manage and motivate them by whatever motivates them, that’s how you win.
Steven Jack Butala:
It’s the first rule of parenting, is meet your children from where they come. And from where they’re coming when they’re two is way different than when they’re 15. So it’s your job to adjust. They’re not going to adjust.
Jill K DeWit:
Yes. So screaming at people is not the way to get stuff done.
Steven Jack Butala:
That’s right. Screaming is not a love language. Speaking of that, my grandmother-
Jill K DeWit:
Maybe screaming … Let’s write the new love languages.
Steven Jack Butala:
That’s the Steve love language book. Here’s your five love language-
Jill K DeWit:
Wait, wait. Can we be-
Steven Jack Butala:
Put downs?
Jill K DeWit:
… like how you were raised?
Steven Jack Butala:
Yes. There’s put downs, screaming. Those are two Steve love languages.
Jill K DeWit:
How about necessary chores?
Steven Jack Butala:
Silence.
Jill K DeWit:
Silence, yeah.
Steven Jack Butala:
Like the silent treatment.
Jill K DeWit:
Shaming.
Steven Jack Butala:
Unnecessary chores.
Jill K DeWit:
And now you’re going to paint that fence again.
Steven Jack Butala:
Drain the pool and scrubbing it. Stuff like that. Oh my gosh.
Jill K DeWit:
Withholding sex. There’s a love language for you. That does it. Embarrassment in public.
Steven Jack Butala:
Unwanted international travel.
Jill K DeWit:
Oh my gosh. That’s great. Okay.
Steven Jack Butala:
You want to freak your spouse out? Put a can rat poisoning on the sink and serve-
Jill K DeWit:
Leave it there.
Steven Jack Butala:
… dinner.
Jill K DeWit:
Serve spaghetti. That’s awful.
Steven Jack Butala:
How far off the topic are we?
Jill K DeWit:
Oh my gosh. Mental torture. Okay.
Steven Jack Butala:
Before we get into it, let’s take a question posted by one of our members on the landinvestors.com online community. It’s free. And don’t forget to subscribe on the Land Academy YouTube channel and comment on the shows you like.
Jill K DeWit:
If you’re saying to yourself, something’s wrong with these two, you are correct.
Steven Jack Butala:
Geez.
Jill K DeWit:
But least we’re screwed up together.
Steven Jack Butala:
That’s right.
Jill K DeWit:
All right. Kristen wrote, “Question for the group. In a blind offer scenario, what is the rule of thumb for number of mailers to accepted offers?”
Steven Jack Butala:
Okay. So this is-
Jill K DeWit:
This is you.
Steven Jack Butala:
… this is the topic. And I’m not picking on you, Kristen, at all. You just happened to ask the question perfectly and directly, and I’m going to answer it. The general rule for rural vacant land is about 1500. For every 1500 offers you send out, you’re going to get probably five people that respond favorably, and then one of those properties is going to work really well under your parameters. So you’re in complete control. Now let’s get to the topic, because you’re not the problem.
Jill K DeWit:
Short and sweet.
Steven Jack Butala:
Today’s topic, improving mailer yield is truly fiction. This is why you’re listening. So I’m teaching this class called get your mailer out. It’s an intensive class, and every single new person who takes this seriously, which I really appreciate, which is not everybody. And I can tell they’re serious, because they take these classes or their Career Path members or whatever. They take it beyond the regular Land Academy membership. They watch the-
Jill K DeWit:
They show up.
Steven Jack Butala:
I can tell who’s what watching the educational programs that Jill and I put together. And you can see the level of intelligence in these questions. It’s very natural when you’re on my … I can’t catch my breath from laughing so hard. It’s very natural if you’re on the Jack side of this, on the data and the analytical side, to look at how I do it and how I describe it and look at it with healthy criticism and judgment and question, which is all good. I think that those are the signs of success in everything, not just Land Academy.
Steven Jack Butala:
So what ends up happening is it’s very natural to say, “Well, Jack, you’re doing it this way, and that’s great. And people in the group are doing it this way. I can tell in Discord. But have you ever considered doing this, this, this and this?” And I have a bunch of template answers for that now. Yeah, I have, but why? That’s my answer. So that’s what this shows really about, why. What happens if I’m wrong and you, new person, who’s got a PhD in data, let’s say, because I certainly don’t.
Jill K DeWit:
I would argue that you do, self-taught.
Steven Jack Butala:
And way more versed in the new technology and how to parse out data and all kinds of stuff, which is what we do. Why haven’t you considered to do it this way? To which I say, why would I do that? This has happened, and I get some version of the same answer every single time. Well, because it’s going to increase your mailer yield. All right. Congratulations, PhD data, that might be true, but it’s 1500 to one. Maybe I do all this stuff, build these tools, spend all this time, reprice everything, try all your new stuff, for what? To get 1200 to one. So I saved what, $35 on a mailer? I reduced hate. I mean, none of those things are really in the end going to work. And the bigger these database tools that you build, the more they break, the more they obsolete quickly. I’m telling you.
Jill K DeWit:
How much time does it take?
Steven Jack Butala:
How much time does it take?
Jill K DeWit:
That’s my thinking.
Steven Jack Butala:
So really what it is, it’s like completing a sculpture and pulling the sheet off of it at the end and patting yourself on the back and saying, “I just spent 1000 hours doing this, and I don’t have any more money. I lost 1000 hours.”
Jill K DeWit:
My wife left.
Steven Jack Butala:
So, here’s my point.
Jill K DeWit:
Whatever.
Steven Jack Butala:
There’s so much marriage this week.
Jill K DeWit:
Sorry.
Steven Jack Butala:
Marital overtones by Jill. My wife left.
Jill K DeWit:
Maybe it’s on my mind.
Steven Jack Butala:
Haven’t taken a shower for three weeks.
Jill K DeWit:
There you go. That’ll do it.
Steven Jack Butala:
So why? So this is what I tell everybody in that environment, and I will continue to do so until somebody says, “I built a database where every three offers I send out, I get a response.” Until that happens, I’m hard and fast on this.
Jill K DeWit:
Three to one.
Steven Jack Butala:
Here, if you really want to improve mailer yield, go to Jill’s side. This is the compliment that got all this crazy stuff started today.
Jill K DeWit:
Thank you.
Steven Jack Butala:
There are, like I said, 1500 to one, five people respond favorably and you choose one property to buy, and go off and double your money. That’s the model. There’s a lot of other people who call back and say, “I’m going to find out who your children are and I’m going to probably murder them next week,” because they’re just upset with the number. We call it the haight, H-A-I-G-H-T. We don’t get threats like that. I’m grossly over … But they’re very upset. What Jill does historically-
Jill K DeWit:
Take my class, which is what we do.
Steven Jack Butala:
Historically, what Jill does, in some cases, not in the crazy cases, will turn those people around and buy the property. That’s true talent. What I do is just numbers and-
Jill K DeWit:
You make my phone ring.
Steven Jack Butala:
… data scrubbing and stuff. It’s not what I do. My side of this is not that big of a deal. There’s not that much to improve on. The system works. We use it. I’m not here to save $35 on a mailer, so I can look in the mirror and say, “God, I’m so smart.” I’m not. The reason that this happens is because I have 25 years of failing and it works now. Jill, on the other hand-
Jill K DeWit:
Thanks.
Steven Jack Butala:
… and Jill’s got a whole following now on her side, these people can answer the phone, take in this hate, meet these people from where they’re coming. They wouldn’t be calling if they’re not-
Jill K DeWit:
Connecting.
Steven Jack Butala:
… real sellers. The people that don’t care about this, get the offer and laugh, show it to their soon to be ex-wife, rip it up and laugh about it and throw it away. If they call you back, or in a lot of cases, mail it back with some kind of note saying you missed a zero, they’re sellers, just not at that price. So what do you do? You get them to get a price or you have some rule about this, some conversion rule. Everybody’s got a price. Make them give you a price or some val … Did you space out?
Jill K DeWit:
No, I wasn’t ready for it. Sorry. I didn’t know I was going to be on the spot.
Steven Jack Butala:
Jill, we’re doing a whole show right now.
Jill K DeWit:
Well I was trying to save some stuff for Friday, because are we going to talk about this more on Friday? But I don’t know. So I mean, I make a game out of it honestly. My goal is to just connect with these people and get their number. There’s a number. Look, you either want to sell or you don’t. This is my whole theory. You either want to sell or you don’t. If you don’t want to sell, great, I get it. Your parents are already buried on the property and your husband’s on the property and you have a spot for you. It’s never leaving the family. I get it. I’m not going to move you all. So, that’s totally fine. I wish you the best. But for everybody else, there is a number, and they may not need the money right now. So their number might be a make me move number. So, that’s not my customer too. Have a great day. That’s not the seller I want to work with. But everybody else, we just need to get to the bottom of it.
Steven Jack Butala:
So follow me on the math here. You send 1500 units out. The five people that they want to sell and you chose the one that works because the other four, they might not be alive. There might be real issues blocking the sale.
Jill K DeWit:
Or no access for something.
Steven Jack Butala:
Now you’ve got something 10 to 15, these are real numbers, 10 to 15 people that are pretty darn angry with the value that you sent them. If Jill converts one of those 10, and we all agree they’re sellers, or most of them are, just not at that price, if we can make one more deal out of a 1500 unit mailer work, my ROI doubles. So please don’t focus on mailer yield on the Jack side. Focus on mailer yield on the Jill side.
Jill K DeWit:
Thank you very much. I appreciate that. Happy you could join us today. Five days a week, you can find us here on the Land Academy Show and House Academy Show, as he’s going to explain.
Steven Jack Butala:
Tomorrow, the episode on the House Academy Show is called Zillow’s buying spree and how it’s gone wrong. You are not alone in your real estate ambition.
Jill K DeWit:
Yeah, that was interesting. I’m not surprised. I was wondering honestly, with these companies that are just like, hey, fill out this form, get a check. I’m like, who’s behind there really checking the property and making sure it’s a good buy and-
Steven Jack Butala:
Nobody.
Jill K DeWit:
That’s what I was wondering. And how’s that going to play out? And honestly, the more companies that were doing it made me feel good, because I’m like, hey, they can all just feed on each other. You know what I mean? We’ll be over here being-
Steven Jack Butala:
Because we’re real estate people, not tech people.
Jill K DeWit:
Well, yeah, exactly. We’re over here being who we are and connecting with people, following through. We’re not making them call this number and press four and wait for somebody and try to get the deal done and get paid out. They can call and we’ll answer. It’s a big difference.
Steven Jack Butala:
Zillow is a private equity startup, like most companies now. Not old companies, but most new ones. And it’s run by money people who are very, very good at spending money and generating a profit on it. That’s why they’re there.
Jill K DeWit:
And not a big one sometimes.
Steven Jack Butala:
And they’re very, very good tech people.
Jill K DeWit:
But yeah.
Steven Jack Butala:
How that translates to buying a house and reselling it for more money, well we’ll talk about it tomorrow.
Jill K DeWit:
Thank you for tuning in. By the way, if you’re a Land Academy member, be sure you join us on Discord. We are Steve and Jill.
Steven Jack Butala:
We are Steve and Jill. Information.
Jill K DeWit:
And inspiration.
Steven Jack Butala:
To buy undervalued property.
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