Transcript: 

Steven Jack Butala:
I’m Steven Jack Butala.

Jill DeWit:
And I’m Jill DeWit. And this is The Land Academy Show.

Steven Jack Butala:
This is episode 1,946, and today we are talking in depth about when to negotiate the price of a land acquisition. And then a little bit later on, I’m going to talk about the backwards psychology of upfront money.

Jill DeWit:
Okay, wait a minute. Last week I couldn’t talk. I was really, really sick. Are you okay today?

Steven Jack Butala:
Yeah, I feel great.

Jill DeWit:
Okay, good. I’m just making sure. What if it’s Jack’s sick week? We had Jill’s sick week. I don’t know if I want a Jack sick week.

Steven Jack Butala:
I just had a quiet, pleasant four hour in my office with the fireplace on and all the windows and doors closed session.

Jill DeWit:
And that’s what made you not talk.

Steven Jack Butala:
Yeah.

Jill DeWit:
Or not be able to talk.

Steven Jack Butala:
Yeah, I’ve just been thinking and not talking. This is what I do at work. The exact opposite of what you do at work.

Jill DeWit:
I know.

Steven Jack Butala:
Talk all day long and then think later.

Jill DeWit:
Thanks.

Steven Jack Butala:
And thinking’s optional. Tell me I’m wrong.

Jill DeWit:
Geez. That’s just not true at all. Sounds like now it’s pick on Jill day.

Steven Jack Butala:
I’m not picking on you. Jill talks all day.

Jill DeWit:
Well, because that’s because of my job.

Steven Jack Butala:
I know.

Jill DeWit:
Okay. It’s not like-

Steven Jack Butala:
No, I don’t mean talk to yourself or meaningless talk. I just mean you’re on the phone.

Jill DeWit:
Could you imagine?

Steven Jack Butala:
That’s just what you do.

Jill DeWit:
I’m just sitting there talking. Who are you talking to? Nobody. No, I don’t do that.

Steven Jack Butala:
Hey, I hope you’re enjoying our relatively new 2023 weekly show, even though it’s March, it’s still new for us. Each week we answer questions from our Land Academy Discord forum, review land acquisitions from our weekly Thursday member webinar and take a deep dive into two land related topics that are almost always by request, which I just mentioned earlier. Let’s take a question posted by one of our members on The Land Academy Discord online community. If you want a sneak peek of our Discord channel, go to landacademy.com in a read only format. It’s free. It’s worth it. Check it out.

Jill DeWit:
All right. So Steven, not you, right?

Steven Jack Butala:
Not me.

Jill DeWit:
Not you. Steven wrote, I have a new deal. We have a signed purchase agreement buy for $8,296.81. And retail is, I love this. 30,827.23. The realtor we’ve been consulting with in the area has a buyer for the property already contingent that it passes perk, but he has just informed us that he charges a $5,000 minimum. This is the realtor. I understand this.

Steven Jack Butala:
I do too. I’m a pro realtor here. Go ahead.

Jill DeWit:
Yeah. Is this the standard? Has any [inaudible 00:02:48] heard of this? I always thought this organization Whitetail Properties, that’s okay, was always 10%. So here’s my experience. The group, the individual, the Whitetail property brokers that I have worked with, I’ve always had sale prices of $70,000 and up and they get 10%. So no matter what, they’re going to lease $7,000. I’ve never had anyone this low. I bet this is a norm for them and it doesn’t scare me at all. The nice thing is when we go up, we go over $100,000 they will sometimes, some of them will rock it back from 10% to 6%, which I appreciate. These guys and I’ve never had a bad experience. I’ve never.

Steven Jack Butala:
So that’s what I was going to say. Whitetail is a lot different than getting a regular Remax real estate agent. Whitetail. These fellas are-

Jill DeWit:
They train them almost.

Steven Jack Butala:
These fellas are land people in their souls like we are. And Land Academy, most Land Academy members are, and you might be if you’re listening to this. So they understand the scenario and the guy’s already got, or the person’s already got an offer in hand. You haven’t retained them yet. And I believe that because I don’t believe that they’re the kind of, in general, they’re the kind of agents that would fib about that or whatever. Let’s do the math. If it was 10%, like Jill said, it’s $3,000 because your sale price is $3,000 or 30,000. Is it worth it to pay somebody $2,000 more to have their expert opinion and they are experts? Again, it’s not a Remax situation. I think so.

Jill DeWit:
I’ve had different, but though I’ve also had this too where I’ve had agents not in areas where we don’t have Whitetail or Mossy Oak and they’ve said, look, here’s the deal. And their minimum was like 4,000. I remember one in particular, I was like, I can’t make the numbers work because I have an assistant, I have a team, I have costs, I do the marketing things, I do the photos and I’m like, you know what? I get it. I’m totally fine with that too. So what’s the end result here? Yes. I think that’s fair. If it were me, I would totally do it. And then the next thing I would do, by the way, go for up my dollar amount, go for properties where I’m selling for 50 and I don’t care on a $5,000 fee.

Steven Jack Butala:
So here’s what you’re going to get for 2,000. Jill’s absolutely right in my opinion, you’re going to get $2,000 more worth of way more value. You need to sit down with this person during this deal or after when the deal’s done and ask them where should I be buying property and for how much is it? And they’ll tell you something like, well, you guys should be looking over in this county for anything over that 40 acres that’s got access. I can sell that for $32,000 an acre or whatever the numbers end up being. And so you can actually tailor now, this is a huge, I call it inside information. This is the kind of stuff you go to prison for on Wall Street. But they encourage in real estate. He’ll tell you buy here and here. I already have buyers lined up.

Jill DeWit:
This is what they want. This is the size.

Steven Jack Butala:
It’s costing you $2,000 more to establish hopefully a relationship with not only that agent but that office. And so now you can start building mailers around what you know you can sell.

Jill DeWit:
Yeah.

Steven Jack Butala:
It’s all positive. Today’s topic, when to negotiate the price of a land acquisition.

Jill DeWit:
Let me give a little backstory.

Steven Jack Butala:
I love this topic by the way. I really do.

Jill DeWit:
Remember the last time we were in Mexico, and I don’t think it was a time we did the global entry time. I think it might have been the last time.

Steven Jack Butala:
I think it was in Rocky Point.

Jill DeWit:
Oh, that was probably it. Okay. Well-

Steven Jack Butala:
Doesn’t matter.

Jill DeWit:
Anyway, Jack and I, we haven’t been in a few years, but we used to love to go out to Mexico and I used to love this part of Mexico. I love shopping for silver. I don’t need any more margarita glasses. I’m all set with that. I’m all set with pictures. I’m set with blankets. I’m set. Let’s think about all this. I don’t need another turtle with a bobble head. You know what I mean?

Steven Jack Butala:
Or a sombrero.

Jill DeWit:
Or a sombrero. Exactly. But you know what? I can’t turn down good silver. So here’s what I do in Mexico. I love to go in and pick out the most beautiful best thing. And then I’ll have a price in my head. I know what my price is, I know what makes sense. I know what price per ounce for silver generally is. Nevermind that’s a whole past life thing that we have. But so I’ve got a good idea what it should cost. And they’re always going to shout whatever number. And I have a number too. So they’re going to throw out a number. And my point of where I’m going with this is, I love this, I love this in Mexico with silver, they say $50 and I say 10, and I know I’m okay with 20, 22. I’ll do it, not 50, but I’m going to throw out 10.
They’re going to go and they’re going to go, no, 45. I’m going to go 12. It’s a game until I’m walking out the door and I’m at my 22, 25. And I’m okay to walk away with this too, by the way, because I know I can go two doors down and get the same stuff and start this all over again. So they’ll let me walk out the door and usually they’ll shout out my number. And for me that situation, it’s a little bit fun. I have a good time. I don’t really care about it. Do I need the silver?

Steven Jack Butala:
Yeah, you don’t care.

Jill DeWit:
Is it my business?

Steven Jack Butala:
That’s what I was going to say.

Jill DeWit:
No. I don’t care.

Steven Jack Butala:
Part of it.

Jill DeWit:
And it’s a game and they expect it. That’s negotiation. And that’s where I’m starting with when negotiation can be a fun and good, lively thing. Now let’s talk about where not to negotiate, which is-

Steven Jack Butala:
That was sport for you.

Jill DeWit:
That was sport and fun and I don’t care. But in my business, I don’t negotiate. Even when I’m not happy with the price, I’m not negotiating.

Steven Jack Butala:
I agree.

Jill DeWit:
We on purpose for many reasons and not just because we don’t want to negotiate, but we just want to get, we’re just trying to get people and buy their property quickly and efficiently in our ballpark kind of thing. So we send out blind offers with numbers on them and some people, some sellers and some buyers, people like me think this is just an open negotiation and I’m here to tell you knock it off. It shouldn’t and it doesn’t need to be. So when I call a seller back, and part of it, I think too, by the way, when Jack here, when our offers go out, they’re down to the penny. It’s not a range, it’s not a, what do you think about this? It’s not fill in another offer if you don’t like this one. It is, I’m willing to buy your property. Here is the price. Here’s the terms, here’s what we’re doing. Are you in or are you out? Kind of thing. We’re not trying to negotiate. So I’m going to say that most of these sellers, when I talk to them, they have that in their head.
They know who I am. I’m not here to negotiate, but could there be a valid reason why it’s worth more? Could have some other information. Is it like you don’t realize I just put in a well and I’m on the road and the water’s across the street? Okay, now I’m going to look at this. I get it kind of thing. But it’s not a negotiation. So it’s funny that this comes up sometimes in our Thursday calls. I feel like people are, I think I can get it for this or will even say though, I’m still in negotiation with them. None of that matters to me. I don’t even want to talk about it. I don’t even look at it. So when people submit offers and they say proposed purchase price, they send in things like for me to review in Land Academy deal review, Jill, here’s a deal. Will you fund this deal?
I think I can get it for X. My immediate response is through my team. Let me know when you got a number and I’ll look at it. I don’t even pull it up on the map. I want to tell you, I won’t even pop it in parcel fact and waste any time because we don’t have a number yet. So you want to jump in here?

Steven Jack Butala:
When you’re ready.

Jill DeWit:
So I’m trying to get two points across that it’s not about negotiation, and I don’t need to think it’s about negotiation and you’re going to get in trouble. You could get in trouble when you go down that path. And I know we have a lot more, we’ll talk more about this.

Steven Jack Butala:
Variables in general kill land deals. And so we do, every Thursday we do a land review on our webinar. We look at people’s deals that they’ve come up with through direct mail campaigns. And I can tell you right from the description very, very quickly which deals are probably going to work and which ones aren’t by the length and the number of words in the presentation that they’re giving. The member. If it takes two blocks in Zoom to describe the deal, that person’s either extremely thorough or a deal doesn’t work because there’s too many variables. Price is a massive variable. The deals that we generally do after this many years are where price is just not, it’s done. I’d like to think I send out mailers, direct mailers that are priced correctly. It doesn’t happen all the time, but let’s just say the majority of the time it does.
And when they call Jill or Jill’s staff back and they say, yeah, I really do want to do this deal, what’s the next step? Then you do the deal. Or if they say something like, yeah, I love this deal. Thanks for the $13,000 offer, but I really need 18,000. Sure, we’ll talk about that. They’re already ready to do the deal mentally and price is not that much of a variable. The problem is this. When you start to veer from that model and a seller, and a lot of people come to Land Academy like this, most of the sellers aren’t the problem. I think it’s brand spanking new Land Academy members that haven’t been exposed to these concepts yet where you have a level of interest, you come to Land Academy with a level of interest in your soul about negotiation and it probably comes from your parents or wherever.
I can’t stand negotiation. I have never liked it. That’s why I came up with this concept of direct mail offers. Here’s a price, take it or leave it kind of thing. Some people, and we have friends like this, we traveled with them that they just love negotiation. The price might be the retail price for a property might be $100,000. We sent an offer for 38,000. They want 40. We all know that’s going to work. But the retail, if the asking price now, not necessarily in a mailer, but somebody posts a piece of property for sale. Let’s say it’s us. Let’s say we buy a piece of property and we sell that same piece of property, that $100,000 property we listed for $75,000, we already know that it’s $25,000 off of retail. We already know that.
And we do that intentionally because we want to sell it fast. We want to just keep cycling through the same acquisition funds all the way through the year. That’s our business model. And a bar will come up and offer 65 and we say, no, it’s already discounted. 75. Well, 68. So Jill’s Mexican negotiation model. That mildly boils my blood.

Jill DeWit:
I know.

Steven Jack Butala:
Because they just have to get money off of what the asking price is without doing any math or actually applying any type of logic.

Jill DeWit:
Well, I expect some of that automatically, but I expect that, but I’m going to entertain one round on those situations and I’m out. So your example, it’s worth $100,000. I have good brokers too. Speaking of Whitetail, I have great Whitetail guys, I think we can get 70, let’s list it at 78. Done. And he and I already had this conversation so we know where we’re going to go with this thing. I’ll entertain one and I might come back on that situation one time and that’s it. And that’s the same with my, when I’m buying a property. I’m trying to think. I think it’s bigger than this. I think it’s the person.

Steven Jack Butala:
I think it’s psychology.

Jill DeWit:
Some people love that. Let’s do this.

Steven Jack Butala:
That’s how I was going to end this.

Jill DeWit:
I want that. I want this. I want that. I can’t do that.

Steven Jack Butala:
So really-

Jill DeWit:
You have one valid reason to tell me why you think it’s worth more. I’m going to listen to it. I’m either going to agree or not agree, and we’re going to meet on a price, and that’s it. Done.

Steven Jack Butala:
If you’re a staunch negotiator, because the world, there’s all kinds of books on this. There’s self-help books and business gurus and people that have real credibility have written books on this topic. And it comes down to are you mentally healthy or not? If you have to negotiate and get your way, you’re never going to, it will crush your career. I’ll give you an example, a great example. You need to know yourself and know your market and know this land, these properties. I just paid $75,000 for a classic Corvette, and that was the asking price. And I know that’s $150,000 car and all the pieces fit together for me. I bought it from a dealer/broker who is a-

Jill DeWit:
We know.

Steven Jack Butala:
Consignment group. We’ve done a bunch of deals with them on the buy side and the sell side before. I had a very brief, logical conversation with the guy, the agent that’s there that we’ve done again, Jill and I have bought cars from before. And he’s like, yeah, it just came in and I’m not selling you anything, but here’s a deal and here’s a box of trophies that it won since the ’60s and all the documents since the ’80s for the repair bills and stuff. So I know these things, I’m not bragging here. I’m just saying, and yeah, it ended up being $150,000 car. So the vast majority of people I know would say that, all right, it’s listed for 75,000 or whatever it ended up being. Will you take 69? Do you really? Does it matter?

Jill DeWit:
Isn’t that funny? It’s the personality of the person. Well, that’s what I was going to say too. We are that kind of a seller. We’re that kind of a buyer and we’re that kind of a seller. I go both ways. I’m really firm on let’s all stand up and not try to, how much time does this take and waste time?

Steven Jack Butala:
And emotional, I already won on that car.

Jill DeWit:
Who cares? We have these conversations all the time too like you’re just saying. Even on properties. Okay, so I’m a buyer now, so I’m buying a property. Our offer was $28,502, whatever, and the guy’s like, can you make it 30? I’m like, you know what? I can make it 30.

Steven Jack Butala:
Totally okay with that.

Jill DeWit:
That’s cool. Don’t be that guy too that’s like I’m digging in.

Steven Jack Butala:
That’s the meaning of this title, of this part of the episode, when to negotiate the price of a land acquisition. And Jill just described it when it’s reasonable, when they need a little bit more, it soothes them psychologically. They feel like they’re hanging up the phone winning, you know you already won anyway. Way won on a thing because maybe it’s an 80 or $90,000-

Jill DeWit:
It’s worth 90.

Steven Jack Butala:
Piece of property and everybody shakes hands.

Jill DeWit:
Totally.

Steven Jack Butala:
That’s when you don’t have to squeeze every single tiny little penny and smash that person’s face down into the mud.

Jill DeWit:
I know.

Steven Jack Butala:
It’s just not, you just don’t want to be that person.

Jill DeWit:
You don’t want to be that guy.

Steven Jack Butala:
You don’t. And I think the vast majority of people come to Land Academy with that kind of, all right, let’s kick their ass. And I don’t think that’s the way to do this.

Jill DeWit:
Sometimes I think it is, I still think it’s confidence, because you started to talk about that a little bit too. People are new to Land Academy. They send these offers out and then they think they need to negotiate a little bit more off it. Hold on a moment. You just need to come out. You already did your homework. You did everything that Jack showed you to find a great area. Download the data, price it really well, trust what you did. Don’t come back and undo it. Well, again, unless like we just said, there’s some real thing out there, and it’s true. I’ve had some where, I still like taking calls sometimes on new mailers. I’ll jump in and take a few to learn about the area and there might be some valid reason that this is being built over here. Did you know this is coming? This is what happened with our water situation. Fill in the blank, whatever. I’m like, ah, I need to know that. That’s going to make me look at these a little bit differently.

Steven Jack Butala:
Over the years since the Land Academy years, not the core land buying years, which were before we started Land Academy, people have come to us socially, and they see the kind of cars that we drive and all the superficial crap about making money. And they say, what the heck do you guys do for a living? And we explain it and they say, you know what? I want to do that too. And it never works. Never.

Jill DeWit:
That’s true.

Steven Jack Butala:
When people come to us and they find us on the internet and a light bulb goes off over their head about, after listening to several podcasts or whatever research that you do, that seems like the thing that I was doing over here before anyway, then this might be just to add to it and might be a better way, then it really works out. I think that a lot of these things that we’re talking about are built in already, and so if what we’re saying to you right now makes sense, you’re one of those people, but without exception, the people that do it the other way-

Jill DeWit:
Try to become.

Steven Jack Butala:
They’re just doing it for the wrong reasons.

Jill DeWit:
If you’ve never been interested in land.

Steven Jack Butala:
But you’re interested in-

Jill DeWit:
Until now and but you’re interested in the bank balance.

Steven Jack Butala:
But you’re interested in being wealthy. This is not the place.

Jill DeWit:
That might not work.

Steven Jack Butala:
This is not going to work.

Jill DeWit:
Exactly. It was either this or I’m going to go get a chain restaurant. I don’t know.

Steven Jack Butala:
Or open an ice cream franchise.

Jill DeWit:
There we go. It was this or Coldstone. You like Coldstone. I know.

Steven Jack Butala:
So negotiate very, very quickly and efficiently. And when it’s a sport for the other person on the other side, I just say, open the next envelope that’s in the mail and buy a different piece of property.

Jill DeWit:
I have one more thing I want to make sure that, just to get this out there, because I still see this happening now and then. This is why you’re listening. Do not get in this situation. You send out an offer, the person responds to you and says, okay, I love it. I don’t love it. I want to sell and everything, but not at that price. It’s not upon you to give them another price. So if like my offer $28,750. So if the guy said, Jill, I like you. I believe in this. I do want to sell the stupid property, but I can’t do that price. What can you do, Jill? I’m not going to give him another number. And I know people fall into that trap. Well then how about 28,500 or 29,500? No. That won’t work.
30. No. Jill, keep at it. You see where it’s going. You’re going to go down a rabbit hole and be in big trouble. Remember, you already gave them a price. You already threw out the first number. You have to let them, even if it takes them a day to get back to you, think about it and come back to you with a number. They know who you are now. They know how you roll. They know how fast you can do this. They know you have the money ready to go, and they like you. You just say, all right, well then let me know what’s your number? Let me back up. They do have a number, by the way. All of these sellers have a number.

Steven Jack Butala:
Yeah, that’s right.

Jill DeWit:
There’s some number in their head. There’s a number in their head that is usually a version of, okay, I bought it back. I bought it 12 years ago. I’ve maintained this many taxes on it that equals X, so I know I need to make X. So they have a number, or it might be, I bought it 20 years ago. I don’t even, God, who knows what it’s worth now, but I do know I’m about $18,000 away from paying off my mortgage. So that’s their number. There you go. So there’s something in their head. You just have to get that out of them.

Steven Jack Butala:
So I structured this concept of sending out blind mailers, blind offers with a number in it, not a range number, not a letter of interest, but an actual number in it, because I did all that stuff wrong my entire career. And ultimately ended up sending out the offers the way we send them out now so that I don’t have to negotiate. So if you send out a 10,000 unit mailer and you do it right, you price it right, you do your homework about where are you’re going to send the mail and you generally do it right, you’re going to get maybe 5, 10, 15, maybe more real honest opportunities to buy a piece of land. And why would you sit around for a half hour or an hour and deal with somebody who’s stubborn about trying to get $60,000 for a property that you’re offering 28 for?
You just wouldn’t. Jill’s exactly right. You just wouldn’t. So let the mail work for you. It’s structured so you don’t have to do cold calling and the people have weeded themselves. Of those 10,000 people, 100 or so let’s say have weeded themselves out of that mailer. They do want to sell. They called you back and a very predictable and consistent percentage want more than you’re willing to pay. So your job is to say, put it in piles. 100 people responded to my mailer, 25 people told me to go F myself. 25 people said, yeah, but the number’s not going to work. Another 25 people said, I don’t know, I’m going to die here.

Jill DeWit:
Some want retail.

Steven Jack Butala:
10 people or so ish are going… Yeah, retail.

Jill DeWit:
Yeah, the ones that want retail, move on, don’t even bother.

Steven Jack Butala:
10 people or so are going to say 28 didn’t work, but 30 will work. Or they’re going to sign it and send it back in many, many cases. So it’s not anything [inaudible 00:25:17] to get-

Jill DeWit:
That’s true.

Steven Jack Butala:
Have any real emotion about. Just let the mailer’s design to take you to the place where you want to go.

Jill DeWit:
You brought up an excellent point. This is not to try to win every single person over who calls you back. Those people who call you back who are holding out for that retail to be the highest priced house on the block kind of thing. That’s not your person. You let them go, wish them well, ask them hang on to your letter and let them go. My 28,000 will never be 60, I hope. And they might come back and they might not.

Steven Jack Butala:
That’s right.

Jill DeWit:
They might die with it.

Steven Jack Butala:
That’s right.

Jill DeWit:
Or the kids might get it. Who knows? But I’m never going to come up to 60 because that’s all they would do.

Steven Jack Butala:
Negotiation is such an interesting psychological concept because it’s pushing the envelope where it shouldn’t go in my opinion. And we don’t do that with other stuff. You don’t drive your car for as long as you possibly can drive it after the E light comes on, the fuel light’s been on for three weeks, you don’t do that. You go fill the tank up. You just don’t push the envelope. You don’t push the envelope with your wife. If she’s upset about something, you don’t just keep pushing her and pushing her.

Jill DeWit:
I hope not or it’s not going to work.

Steven Jack Butala:
And you don’t negotiate with your wife, by the way. Don’t.

Jill DeWit:
Nope.

Steven Jack Butala:
Ever.

Jill DeWit:
Nope.

Steven Jack Butala:
Just walk out of the room.

Jill DeWit:
Exactly. Pick your battles.

Steven Jack Butala:
So why push it so hard to get an extra $3,000 out of a deal?

Jill DeWit:
Exactly.

Steven Jack Butala:
That it just doesn’t matter.

Jill DeWit:
I know.

Steven Jack Butala:
You got what you want. You won.

Jill DeWit:
Yeah. Thank you.

Steven Jack Butala:
Let’s take a look at one of our favorite land acquisitions from our weekly Thursday member webinar. By the way, I talked to our guys, they pulled these from three months ago already. They don’t do it from last month.

Jill DeWit:
Okay, good. Will you do the ad?

Steven Jack Butala:
Nah, I don’t want to. You can. Do you want me to do it?

Jill DeWit:
No. You know what? Okay, this airs on the 30th. Okay, I got one. Hey, you know what, Jack? We are 12 days away from Career Path. Are you excited?

Steven Jack Butala:
I love instructing Career Path.

Jill DeWit:
I am too.

Steven Jack Butala:
Of all the responsibilities I have at Land Academy, that is my favorite thing. And I’m not blowing smoke because people want to be there.

Jill DeWit:
Oh my God. I know. So I want to just take a moment and talk about Career Path and remind you that I don’t know if I have any slots yet. You could sure reach out to my team, but let me tell you what’s going on. April 12th will be Career Path number six, and I don’t know when seven and eight will be. So if you’re thinking about it, you want to get in Career Path six. So Career Path is our highest level personal done by us coaching session. It’s eight weeks long, only 15 people, and it’s phenomenal. We are repeatedly now have people coming back from Career Paths one, two, and three showing up in older Career Paths to do it again. Why are they coming back? Because it was that great. They know it gets better every time, and I think they’re back to even level up even more.
They’re like, great. Career Path three got me to this much money. I’m back to do Career Path six to bring it home. So wherever you are in your land investment journey, if you want to be like us and just make this your thing, you’re done. I know where I want to go. This is going to be my life. I want to do deals like you guys. I want to have a staff like you guys. I want to make this as easy as I can like you guys. That’s what Career Path is. So check it out. Go to landacademy.com/careerpath or just send a note to my team support@landacademy.com.

Steven Jack Butala:
We have presentations during Career Path by all of our staff. Jill’s transaction coordinator, the person who does concierge data, who does our mailers. So they all-

Jill DeWit:
Show up.

Steven Jack Butala:
In a very intimate business setting tell you why they’re successful for us and with us. It’s pretty cool.

Jill DeWit:
It is.

Steven Jack Butala:
There’s nothing else like it.

Jill DeWit:
Totally.

Steven Jack Butala:
Let’s take another question posted by one of our members on the Land Academy Discord online community. Again, if you want a sneak peek at our Discord channel, please go to landacademy.com. It’s free.

Jill DeWit:
Is this the same person?

Steven Jack Butala:
Mm-mm.

Jill DeWit:
The same name? Oh.

Steven Jack Butala:
I feel qualified to make this statement. There’s Steven, S-T-E-V-E-N. There’s Stephen, S-T-E-P-H-E-N and there’s Stephan, S-T-E-P-H-A-N. Of all the things-

Jill DeWit:
Excuse me.

Steven Jack Butala:
We talked about today that’s the thing I’m most qualified to talk about.

Jill DeWit:
Excuse me. Stephan Rota. Geez. Talk about pushing your partner’s buttons.

Steven Jack Butala:
Okay, Jillie.

Jill DeWit:
I’m okay with that.

Steven Jack Butala:
All right Jillian.

Jill DeWit:
I don’t care. That’s not my name, but it’s okay.

Steven Jack Butala:
What does it say on your birth certificate?

Jill DeWit:
Jill.

Steven Jack Butala:
J-I-L-L.

Jill DeWit:
That’s it.

Steven Jack Butala:
That’s awesome.

Jill DeWit:
Yeah, it’s not short for anything. It is just Jill.

Steven Jack Butala:
Not Stephanopoulos or something.

Jill DeWit:
No.

Steven Jack Butala:
Jillinacious.

Jill DeWit:
Jillifer. No. It’s nothing. All right. So Stephan wrote, I’m going to quit my nine to five here soon. I’m based in California, and my only hangup is healthcare seems like a huge can of worms to investigate. I currently have Blue Shield Platinum with my W2. What can I expect to pay for something similar? Should I work part-time at Starbucks just for the cheap health insurance and free coffee? That’s not crazy actually.

Steven Jack Butala:
It’s not.

Jill DeWit:
That actually might be kind of fun.

Steven Jack Butala:
There’s nine things right with this question.

Jill DeWit:
I know.

Steven Jack Butala:
And zero things wrong in my opinion.

Jill DeWit:
It has never crossed my mind other than the fact that I don’t ever want to have a nine to five again or even a part-time gig like that. But if I could show up when I want to and just help out in Starbucks, I would do that.

Steven Jack Butala:
I love this question. You are planning for war. You’ve premeditated this. You’ve got a checklist. Health insurance is on that checklist. So you went to the community and you’re asking. A bunch of people responded to this.

Jill DeWit:
Oh, good.

Steven Jack Butala:
This is an incredibly intelligent question and it’s simple, and I really think you’re going to succeed.

Jill DeWit:
The only thing Stephan didn’t come up with is marry someone with good health insurance.

Steven Jack Butala:
Please don’t do that.

Jill DeWit:
No, but I bet that’s in there. I worked with a gal. That was her thing. It was at American Airlines.

Steven Jack Butala:
Of all the wrong reasons to get married as if there’s any good reasons to get married. That’s on the list.

Jill DeWit:
Her husband wouldn’t let her quit her job because he needed the health insurance.

Steven Jack Butala:
If your husband won’t let you-

Jill DeWit:
I know.

Steven Jack Butala:
Quit your job, maybe-

Jill DeWit:
Well, they’re divorced now.

Steven Jack Butala:
Yeah. Find another husband.

Jill DeWit:
By the way I don’t think she’s there anymore. I’m sure she’s not. But anyway, this is good.

Steven Jack Butala:
All healthcare providers to directly answer your question, and then I’m going to give you some compliments after this, provide independent insurance policies, all the major ones, and you don’t want to veer off within health insurance at all. And you don’t want to use your health broker, healthcare insurance broker because they mark it all up and you don’t want to veer from the major carriers. You already have Blue Cross. So I’d call them.

Jill DeWit:
And keep COBRA for a while.

Steven Jack Butala:
So you’re going to have COBRA for what, six months?

Jill DeWit:
Sometimes a year.

Steven Jack Butala:
Whatever happens in California, it’s probably-

Jill DeWit:
Oh, it’s probably five years in California.

Steven Jack Butala:
And it’s free.

Jill DeWit:
Exactly. Don’t worry about it, you’re set.

Steven Jack Butala:
They’re going to have a program for you. They’re very in tune with your situation, and they will have, if you don’t have any dependents and you’re young, it’s going to be shockingly cheap. So I don’t think it’s going to be more than three to $300, maybe 400.

Jill DeWit:
Probably.

Steven Jack Butala:
Probably less. I’m old and my insurance policy is maybe 700, which-

Jill DeWit:
Yours is more than mine.

Steven Jack Butala:
But I’ve got people attached to mine too, and it’s a different story. So just call your carrier, and if you don’t like the numbers, call around. There’s all kinds of HMOs and PPOs that are in California. HMOs and PPOs originated there with Kaiser Permanente. So I would call Kaiser Permanente because it’s very prevalent in California.

Jill DeWit:
What if he leaves California?

Steven Jack Butala:
If you leave out of your network, you are going to have to get a new insurance policy anyway. You don’t want to get… [inaudible 00:33:47] Out of network is a terrible thing, especially in emergency situation because it’s going to be expensive. But ask the person at Blue Cross that you have the insurance with right now and call the person, whoever your HR person is. They know all this stuff.

Jill DeWit:
Are we really talking this much about healthcare?

Steven Jack Butala:
Guy wants to quit his job. I love this stuff.

Jill DeWit:
Okay, good.

Steven Jack Butala:
He’s learning. He’s asking.

Jill DeWit:
I do. I get it.

Steven Jack Butala:
Is that a joke?

Jill DeWit:
No.

Steven Jack Butala:
I think it’s important as heck.

Jill DeWit:
No, you’re right, you’re just, you’re going down the, do we now want to bring up copays?

Steven Jack Butala:
If you’re going to increase your copay, your insurance is going to be way cheaper.

Jill DeWit:
True.

Steven Jack Butala:
Just work your way down your list. And I hope you quit your job and I hope you’re ready. I hope you’ve done a bunch of deals and it’s not too soon. And I’m happy for you.

Jill DeWit:
What’s interesting, I would just like to add, here’s a big picture comment on this to end this question is-

Steven Jack Butala:
She shut me down, but now she’s going to continue the topic.

Jill DeWit:
That was never a consideration for me as far as leaving a company.

Steven Jack Butala:
It was a huge consideration for me. But that’s the difference between you and I. One of the differences.

Jill DeWit:
That’s wild.

Steven Jack Butala:
But that’s why it works together. You and I.

Jill DeWit:
Thank you.

Steven Jack Butala:
Today’s second topic is the backward psychology of upfront money. What do you have to pay upfront for in your life and then you don’t believe that it worked out?

Jill DeWit:
Health insurance.

Steven Jack Butala:
When a company-

Jill DeWit:
Perfect.

Steven Jack Butala:
Let’s use the Northern California startup model for a business, let’s say like Uber. So Uber goes out, they have a assembled credible tech team and what’s called a little bit of, let’s call it a deck, a 10 or 15 page printed out, usually a deck to go shop to find money, to start what they think is going to be the greatest, best thing ever. Stand on a corner, use your app, get a car to come and pick you up. Turns out that works. And so there’s millions and millions and tens and hundreds of millions of capital that’s required upfront to start something like that. And there’s no scared money. The people that are providing that money upfront, there’s no psychology behind it that they know that’s how it works. They also know that for every 10, 20, 30, 40 of those that they spend money on, only one or two, maybe three are going to work, which justifies all the money that they’re spending. And that’s that business model. That’s that startup model.
What else do you put a bunch of money upfront? A house. You put 10, 15, 20% down on a house and you make payments. I’ve never seen people be more happy in their entire lives to get into debt than when buying a house. So there’s some upfront money, but if you ask most people, it works out. You bought a house, you paid some payments, you decided to sell it, and you made some money on it theoretically, hopefully. There’s certain things about upfront money that just like purchasing an app. For whatever reason, most of the people I know, wealthy people even have a problem spending 3.99 on an app when there’s another free one over there that’s way substandard.

Jill DeWit:
You mean $3.99.

Steven Jack Butala:
$3.99.

Jill DeWit:
Like whatever I spend on, Spotify. I love Spotify.

Steven Jack Butala:
So think about your college education that can cost $200,000.

Jill DeWit:
I was thinking about that.

Steven Jack Butala:
That’s huge upfront money so that you theoretically can pay it off for God knows how long after you get a job when you get out. No problem there. [inaudible 00:37:30] People don’t have any issues with that.

Jill DeWit:
That’s true.

Steven Jack Butala:
Honestly, because I don’t think it’s their money. I think they go buy, they go get a student loan.

Jill DeWit:
And then it’s their money though.

Steven Jack Butala:
But for some reason, people have a massive problem writing a $38,000 check for a piece of land that they know is worth $78,000. And the truth is, and this is from my soul, good. It keeps everybody out of this business.

Jill DeWit:
That’s true.

Steven Jack Butala:
Because if this makes sense to you and the light bulb’s going off to write a $38,000 check and get 62, 82, 92 back within a month, then you get it. And so I’m going to quote Dr. Phil here. You either get it or you don’t. Upfront money can’t be explained to most people. And if you have to explain why it costs $120,000 to open a convenience store so that you can have a job and you can put food on your family for 25 years after that because you made a good decision on location and all of it.
If you have to explain that to somebody, maybe they’re related to you and you have to sit them down and explain why this is a good idea. It’s not good. You get it. They don’t. So where’s this all going? The Land Academy education program costs, I don’t know, what does it cost? $2,000. And it’s just, our salespeople are inbound intake salespeople who take phone calls are always chuckling about this because the return, we have several every single time we do a Career Path, it’s I made $6 million this year and I really want to make 18.

Jill DeWit:
I know, but oh, I don’t know if I could write a check for three. I’m like what?

Steven Jack Butala:
It’s the psychology-

Jill DeWit:
Or 20.

Steven Jack Butala:
Of upfront money.

Jill DeWit:
It is.

Steven Jack Butala:
And so like all things in life, whether it’s education or your professional, your career or your relationships, you need to know yourself. You need to look at yourself in the mirror and say, do I have a problem with upfront money? Like wacko Jack is saying.

Jill DeWit:
You know what’s funny about this? I just thought of a great situation. Here’s a crazy upfront money expense. How about a wedding?

Steven Jack Butala:
Oh my God. So that’s not upfront money. That’s a disaster. That’s expensing after tax money for no benefit.

Jill DeWit:
For a party. That could have been done for free somewhere else. On a beach as a picnic.

Steven Jack Butala:
Go buy a $30,000 piece of real estate. We were talking about this in the advanced call. Go buy a piece of $30,000 real estate that’s worth 150. Get a keg, a couple of kegs, invite your friends and have a party. And there’s your party.

Jill DeWit:
On the property that you buy.

Steven Jack Butala:
Bring your sleeping bag. That you own.

Jill DeWit:
Then sell the property.

Steven Jack Butala:
And tell me which is more fun, a wedding or that. And if it’s a big enough piece of property and you know your friends well enough, bring some firearms.

Jill DeWit:
So what is it? So can we talk about this for a few? We clearly don’t have this trouble, but I just need to do some recon. I have no trouble writing checks. Definitely for land. Because why? Because I do my due diligence. I make sure it’s a good investment. For education. I still do education stuff.

Steven Jack Butala:
Me too.

Jill DeWit:
I told you I brought you one. I’m not going to do it. But I talked to, I just brought to Jack the other day a Stanford continuing education class that I was considering, and he’s like, I don’t think you’d need it. So I’m like, well, thank you. I appreciate that compliment. It’s not about the money. It wasn’t about the money. It was me going, I asked you, I’m looking at this course. Do you think it would benefit me? And you’re like, I know you. And it wouldn’t, not, how much was it? How long is it? How much time is it going to take from us? None of that. It was only about what it was.

Steven Jack Butala:
Well, you know what that it is about that since you brought it up, I don’t want some education. I don’t want you to be educated so that it breaks your style. I want you to continue to manage the people that are under you with that Jill style and continue to do real estate deals. And I’m honestly afraid if you go to-

Jill DeWit:
It was a [inaudible 00:41:54] course.

Steven Jack Butala:
It was Stanford freaking, what was Stanford? And it was long.

Jill DeWit:
It was $20,000.

Steven Jack Butala:
I don’t care about the money one bit.

Jill DeWit:
Weeks [inaudible 00:42:02]

Steven Jack Butala:
I want my Jill back after that. I’m afraid that won’t happen.

Jill DeWit:
Thank you. But I thought maybe I could even jush it up and be even be better at it. I’m always reading books about it. I’m reading a book right now about it. I’m always trying to better myself anyway, no matter what. So I tip the scale up. But what’s interesting is, so for me, that must be you’re either worried about the money or you’re worried about, if you’re worried about money on stuff like this, I think you either, A, don’t know yourself.

Steven Jack Butala:
That’s what I think. You nailed it.

Jill DeWit:
B, didn’t do enough research to make sure this is right. And then C is really kind of A.

Steven Jack Butala:
Look, upfront money. Here’s my whole point to writing this topic. Upfront money can be categorized in two buckets. Number one, you are buying something or putting money down, let’s say on something that you believe at the back end of it is way more valuable than the front end. And so putting a down payment on a new car is, you’ll never win on that.

Jill DeWit:
True.

Steven Jack Butala:
Just the backend is way worse.

Jill DeWit:
True.

Steven Jack Butala:
And the number two thing is, it’s what I just described. You’re not going to get anything out of it. So you have to decide what’s worth it and what’s not. It shouldn’t be, I don’t think a very long conversation with yourself. I’m going to go to medical school because I want to be a surgeon, that’s the whole conversation with yourself. Because you know what’s going to happen on the tail end of that.

Jill DeWit:
You’re going to be fine.

Steven Jack Butala:
You’re going to win. You and your family are going to win.

Jill DeWit:
Yeah. There wouldn’t be doctors in the world today if they didn’t pay off the student loans, even though it took them eight years or whatever it was.

Steven Jack Butala:
Or even welding school. Trade schools. The greatest value ever is becoming a specialized welder or some version of that. You put the money down or even get a loan, you’re going to come out of that great.

Jill DeWit:
Do you know what’s funny when you think about that? I do see in trade schools and things like that, huge value for a lot of people. I look at, that’s us. Land Academy’s like that. We’re teaching you a nichey specialized thing that you can go off and put food on the table for yourself.

Steven Jack Butala:
Taking a chance on the stock market with a bunch of money upfront.

Jill DeWit:
Oh my gosh.

Steven Jack Butala:
Worst idea ever.

Jill DeWit:
I can’t even imagine that.

Steven Jack Butala:
You should go to the craps table. It’d be faster and easier to convince yourself that’s probably not a good idea unless you went to school for that and you have a brain for that. And you’re one of the very small percentages of people that make $1 billion doing it. I get that.

Jill DeWit:
Yeah, I bet there’s some of that too. It’s just not us.

Steven Jack Butala:
So like everything today, what we’re talking about is just the psychology of it and a personality. And so light bulbs either go off when you’re talking about land or they don’t. And if they don’t, I wouldn’t. I would just look for something else.

Jill DeWit:
It didn’t sing to you. And there’s nothing wrong with that.

Steven Jack Butala:
Let’s take a look at another one of our favorite land acquisitions from our weekly Thursday member webinar. Jill, do you have something inspirational to share with us today?

Jill DeWit:
Okay. I wanted to talk for a few minutes about work-life balance, because you’ve been talking about that with our staff and I’ve been thinking about that since our first Land Academy 2023 ladies group gathering, which I love. It’s so fun. Because you know what’s funny about that? This topic came up, but not as much as I thought it would. So when we got together our first meeting a couple weeks ago and I said, all right, what are you here for? What’s going on? And the top things were community, building wealth, including retiring their husbands, and then a bunch of other little things. But those two things were the big ones. But I was thinking about work-life balance, probably because you brought it up a lot this week within our staff.

Steven Jack Butala:
We’re going through a whole thing with our staff about making sure they’re happy.

Jill DeWit:
I feel like we had the Covid change and now we’re coming back from. I think we’re finding a groove right now within our lives and our company about and going forward, how often are we in the office? What are we working on? How hard are we working? That kind of a thing. So that’s where it all ties in for me. So I was thinking, it made me think about my work-life balance, and I was going to ask you about your work-life balance, and I’m thinking about what’s important to me, you know what my number one thing is?

Steven Jack Butala:
I want to hear this.

Jill DeWit:
That’s important to me.

Steven Jack Butala:
Working naked all day.

Jill DeWit:
That’s important to you. That’s not important to me.

Steven Jack Butala:
I wonder if you can even say that. I’m sure you can.

Jill DeWit:
I’m sure you can. Exactly. So thank you for that. That was good. I appreciate that. Now what’s really important to me is I cruise through every single day whether I’m at work or at not honestly, is having fun. It’s not my bank balance. It’s not stroking my ego or I don’t know, whatever you can think of. It’s like nothing. It’s just having fun. So if I am not in an environment, whether it’s Friday night fun or at my desk and it’s not fun, I’m not happy, it’s not working. And it could just be little things. Just not necessarily working naked, but that might make some people laugh, but I need to have that and I do. Here’s the nice happy result I report back is that I do, we have a great staff. We have a phenomenal community. This community is so supportive and awesome and helpful. So I really do. I’ve been having oodles of phone calls the last couple weeks, people asking about Career Path and I love it. I’m meeting so many people and hearing their stories and just having a good time.

Steven Jack Butala:
Why do you love it?

Jill DeWit:
Because it’s fun. Maybe it is, maybe it’s more to this. I like having fun and I do like helping people.

Steven Jack Butala:
That’s what I think is going on and that’s why I ask. So work-life balance for me, and we’ll get back to that in a second, Jill, because it’s super important, is a short list of stuff that has to go on all at the same time for me. And I know that’s why you’re in this, because you believe. We teach the thing. You’ve seen the outcome. You’ve seen people that are coming back in our alumni group with massively amazing results.

Jill DeWit:
Totally.

Steven Jack Butala:
And I think that really makes it all worth it to you, even for you, which is different for you, more than the money.

Jill DeWit:
Oh definitely.

Steven Jack Butala:
I think you want to make a difference.

Jill DeWit:
Way more than the money.

Steven Jack Butala:
If I’m putting your words in your mouth, please stop me.

Jill DeWit:
I agree.

Steven Jack Butala:
I think you want to make a difference in people’s lives.

Jill DeWit:
I do.

Steven Jack Butala:
And you look back at all the stuff that you’ve done for a living long before buying and selling land and then Land Academy. That’s what you’ve done.

Jill DeWit:
That’s true. Thank you. And I believe that I do that. Even with our sellers. Why I like talking to sellers and talking to buyers. I’m helping sellers get out of a property they don’t want anymore. They’d rather have the cash. They love that. And then the same thing then when I turn around and sell it to people, I’m helping them buy their dream property. So I am helping them and I want to have fun while I’m doing it. So tell me more about yours.

Steven Jack Butala:
My work-life balance, again is a short list of things that in a perfect world all go on at the same time to accomplish that one big thing, which is what we’re all talking about, which is just satisfaction. And it’s the same thing that goes on in an interpersonal relationship like Jill and I have, or a relationship with our children. It’s the exact same thing. It’s a balance of a few things. It’s a recipe of a few things that need to go together. For me, and I’m not apologizing for this at all, is money at the top. I’m not going to do something just for money, but if I’m going to do something, there better be a lot of money involved.
Or I’m not going to do it. I will move on and do something else. Number one. Number two, what I’m doing to achieve that initial goal needs to be not very risky. That’s why we dog on the stock market all the time, and we dog on real estate agents on this show all the time because I think both of those things have a very high failure rate. And so buying and selling land for us just makes sense and I don’t see any real risk in it.

Jill DeWit:
I agree.

Steven Jack Butala:
And we’ve proven that over and over again. So we’ve got money. Low to zero risk. I do want to have fun. That’s in the mix, but I learned since we started Land Academy, really it’s very important for me to pass on the knowledge, and I don’t want to sound altruistic here at all. It’s not altruism, but I do need to give back to some community, this community that we created. And I love, this is what I love about Career Path. I really love watching people take this farther than Jill and I have ever taken it and making it work for themselves, and especially in Career Path and in the alumni, the stuff that goes on after that, hearing people take their family on vacation and they don’t have to work hard and their wife doesn’t work anymore, and they’ve had a lot of success with it.

Jill DeWit:
They’ve quit their jobs.

Steven Jack Butala:
So that’s something that I never knew was even possible in a career. I didn’t know that there was an unintended consequence for starting Land Academy.

Jill DeWit:
That’s true.

Steven Jack Butala:
And so that’s why, and I’m not selling anything, I’ve decided to keep it moving forward with manplan.com. I think that there’s a lot of resources for young men or just men in general that are going undiscussed in this world that we live in now. And it’s not an advertisement. I don’t want to go on about that, but work-life balance to me is all those things. And I’m starting to get it and haven’t in the past. I’m starting to feel great about being a leader with a lot of our employees. Jill and I are taking a much more active role in the day-to-day leadership of our… Jill’s always done it with the land people, but the people in Land Academy, the guys that work there. We’re starting to have a bunch of fun and it’s really rewarding. Reward is the word. I need to be rewarded.

Jill DeWit:
That’s good.

Steven Jack Butala:
So I’m financially rewarded. There’s no real risk. I’m people rewarded. And watching people grow is it’s very-

Jill DeWit:
You know what I was going to add too about, for me, work-life balance? If you enjoy what you’re doing, like you’re talking about for you and I, then it doesn’t feel like work. So I don’t leave my desk, close my office door, and then not think about Land Academy, not think about land, not think about real estate. I don’t just flip a switch. It’s always going constantly.

Steven Jack Butala:
Jill and I-

Jill DeWit:
Because I love it.

Steven Jack Butala:
Jill and I have an amazing luxury at this point at our age, and at this point in our careers, and I wish this for everyone in every job or if you’re an owner of a company, there’s stuff you just hate to do and there’s stuff you love to do. We have the luxury of hiring people under us to do the stuff that we don’t want to do. I don’t post produce video anymore. That’s a huge luxury. We have a person who handles HR in all those types of in office space and general office management. So that’s a massive luxury. I can just focus on doing the show and starting man plan and instructing Career Path.

Jill DeWit:
And Career Path.

Steven Jack Butala:
Yep.

Jill DeWit:
Exactly. Good talk. Jack, do you have something informational to share with us, please?

Steven Jack Butala:
Yes. It directly relates to Jill’s topic. I have, like I said last week, I’m 56 years old and I’m starting to financially plan for retirement. And execute the plan that I’ve had for a long time for retirement, but I keep researching all this new stuff that’s out. And what keeps coming back to me is what matters during retirement. They never bring up money. I read a whole article that Warren Buffet wrote.

Jill DeWit:
Interesting.

Steven Jack Butala:
It was a very lengthy article about, and you know what he kept saying throughout? I want to hang out with my friends. My topic here is personality and lifelong friendships. And so you need to be some version of friends with the people in your life, including your employees. And I’m not saying great friends, because that’s a super bad idea, but you need to identify with them from where they’re coming, which is why I launched this whole thing. You need to find out from where they’re coming. You need to meet them there within reason. These are all results of all this research that I’m doing.

Jill DeWit:
I’m glad. I love it.

Steven Jack Butala:
And they’ll stay with you forever. They’ll perform with you forever. They’ll feel rewarded. And so it’s not more, it’s less about my work-life balance for me at this age. And it’s more about people in Land Academy, certainly Jill, which she takes responsibility for. So I’m lucky there. And the people that work with us, I want them to feel good. And as far as personality goes, I can’t say this enough because again, I keep coming. This keeps smacking me in the face with all this research. You have to hang out socially with people that have the same type of personality that you do and that have the same kind of values that you do.

Jill DeWit:
That’s true.

Steven Jack Butala:
And so this whole today has been really about personality.

Jill DeWit:
Yeah, it’s true. That’s really good. Makes me think of your dad and his golfing buddies. He’s done a good job aligning himself with the people that are just like him. And everybody has a good time.

Steven Jack Butala:
Join us next week, next Wednesday actually for another interesting episode, because you are not alone in your real estate ambition. We are Jack and Jill.

Jill DeWit:
We are Jack and Jill.

Steven Jack Butala:
Information.

Jill DeWit:
And inspiration.

Steven Jack Butala:
To buy undervalued property.

Jill DeWit:
It’s nice I can talk today.